The STEM Podcast/ Le balado des STIM

Diversity in geoscience: Participation, behaviour, and the division of scientific labour at a Canadian geoscience conference 

Introduction to the Special Issue on Gender and Geoethics in the Geosciences 

“A Space of their Own?” Professional Women’s Groups in the Alberta STEM Resource Sector 

In the Field 

Partners’ uptake of parental benefits: An upward trend? 

Employment Standards Act, S.O. 2000, c. 41 

Occupational Health and Safety Act 

Aakanksha [00:00:04]: Welcome to WomanACT’s Podcast, where experience meets research and research drives better policy.

Aakanksha [00:00:12]: In this first episode, we’re stepping into the world of geosciences — a field shaped by remote fieldwork, hands-on experience, and the environments where careers are built. But those same conditions can also make it harder to access opportunities, speak up, and feel safe. To explore that, we’re joined by two women whose careers span very different parts of the field, but whose stories connect in powerful ways.

Aakanksha [00:00:37]: We began by asking them to reflect on what first drew them into geosciences and what their early experiences entering these industries revealed about the culture they would eventually have to navigate.

Aakanksha [00:00:54]: Our first guest, Melanie Siewert, is an environmental geoscientist with over 27 years of industry experience. She is now the CEO of Professional Geoscientists Ontario, where she has been leading the organization’s efforts to strengthen the profession and its role in protecting the public.

Aakanksha [00:01:17]: Could you maybe tell us a little bit about your path into geosciences? What drew you into the field?

Melanie [00:01:24]: I have to say that I did not pick geosciences. I think geosciences just sort of found me over the years. In high school, I was not looking at STEM. I don’t even think we talked about STEM back then.

Melanie [00:01:37]: When I registered for university, I was actually registered in a Bachelor of Arts program for International Development Studies. By the second year, I was taking more science courses than arts courses.

Melanie [00:01:51]: From there, in my career path, I really just leaned into what the geosciences have to offer. It is continuous learning, and the logistics really fed my passion.

Aakanksha [00:02:04]: Our second guest, Victoria, is a mining geologist with more than a decade of international experience in Latin America and Canada, specializing in gold and silver exploration and large-scale drilling programs to expand mineral reserves.

Victoria [00:02:22]: I’m a geologist with more than 10 years of experience in exploration and underground mining, looking for gold and silver. When I first applied to university to choose a career, I was a teenager, and I said, “I want to work in something, but I don’t want to be in the office only.”

Victoria [00:02:45]: This career looked like it could fit my requirements and what I wanted to do in my life because it combines knowledge with going outside and walking through different explorations.

Victoria [00:03:00]: If you like to go outside, enjoy the environment, enjoy rocks, and experience different kinds of weather, this is a good career to follow.

Aakanksha [00:03:11]: Looking back at those conversations, what stood out was how both women were drawn not only to science, but also to the mix of fieldwork, problem-solving, and constant learning. They were pursuing paths that were far from conventional.

Aakanksha [00:03:26]: Their experiences also revealed that once inside the field, being capable was not always enough. Both spoke about the pressure to constantly prove competence and credibility in environments where women are still often underestimated.

Melanie [00:03:43]: If I look back to what gender expectations there may have been, my biggest focus was really on how I dressed. It sounds ridiculous, but I spent a lot of time and energy trying to figure out how to wear the equivalent of a male khakis-and-collared-shirt look.

Melanie [00:04:00]: It was mostly because my boss at the time would just pop into my office and say, “Hey, want to go on a field trip?” That was where the opportunities were.

Melanie [00:04:09]: If I were not in a position to say, “Yeah, for sure,” at a moment’s notice, I was going to miss out on whatever career advancement was available. I would absolutely describe it as an old boys’ club.

Aakanksha [00:04:23]: This idea of a boys’ club is not always about something explicit. It is often much more subtle than that. A shared culture often exists among men, where common interests such as sports, work, or other activities create opportunities for casual banter and relationship-building.

Aakanksha [00:04:44]: Research shows us that women and underrepresented groups are less likely to be invited to give talks, lead projects, or take on high-visibility roles, which are key pathways to advancement.

Victoria [00:04:57]: That’s true. Even when people talk about sports, for example, if you don’t know hockey, you feel like you don’t belong there. The boys’ club does exist.

Victoria [00:05:08]: The supervisor is not with us the whole time. There are core logging geologists doing their jobs — the 10 of us. Then the supervisor comes by from time to time to see us, and he talks with the guys about sports or what they like.

Victoria [00:05:28]: They say, “Okay, in the afternoon, we can join or meet after work to do this or that.” So yes, that does exist.

Aakanksha [00:05:37]: Even though the settings were different — consulting and environmental geosciences for Melanie, and mining and exploration for Victoria — both stories pointed to the same underlying issue. Women are often expected to adapt, anticipate, or prove themselves in ways men are not.

Aakanksha [00:05:55]: Researchers often describe this as the “prove-it-again” bias, where competence is not assumed equally, and women are expected to demonstrate it repeatedly over time.

Aakanksha [00:06:06]: When you first entered geosciences, what did you expect it would take to be seen as competent? How did that compare to what you actually experienced in the field?

Victoria [00:06:18]: First, I was a little scared because I did not know whether they were going to give me the same opportunities as the men, my colleagues. I remember that I usually wanted to go underground, but the first thing they gave me was a core logging job.

Victoria [00:06:34]: It is not necessarily the easier part, but it is the task that most geologists can do, and it is mostly given to women. My goal was to go underground, but I did not have that opportunity right away.

Victoria [00:06:49]: To be noticed as women who can do the same job as any male colleague, we have to show that physically. We go underground with a lot of equipment — heavy boots, heavy flashlights, and various devices. We have to show that we can do that.

Victoria [00:07:08]: What happened was that I had to work more than they did to show my skills. I had to show that I could walk underground and operate the mobile equipment underground. I had to work more than they did to have the opportunity to go underground.

Victoria [00:07:27]: Going into an underground mine is a huge experience for any geologist because you can see in more detail what is happening there, and you have more responsibilities. That is what I like about it. It gives you the opportunity to grow in the field.

Victoria [00:07:46]: You also have to speak up and show your bosses what else you can do. Men do not have to show that in the same way. People assume they can do it. They think that, as women, we cannot do it. But no, we can. Absolutely, we can do anything that we want.

Aakanksha [00:08:09]: That pressure to prove yourself makes workplace culture even more important. Part of that comes down to access. Who gets invited to lead projects, take on fieldwork, or step into high-visibility roles? All of those are critical for career progression.

Aakanksha [00:08:24]: Supportive managers and colleagues can make a real difference, whether that means speaking up when something is not right, recognizing someone’s work, or simply making space for others to be heard. So tell us a little bit more about what allyship has looked like in your experience.

Melanie [00:08:41]: I’m going to say this over and over: allyship absolutely matters. Having great allies at the table when decisions are being made, when conversations are being had, and when someone missteps and someone else corrects them — I think that is the most important piece.

Melanie [00:08:56]: There was one time when a senior colleague and I were going to visit a potential client. We had been putting together a bid for this individual, and it was for the redevelopment of a former industrial property.

Melanie [00:09:11]: I had been working for a couple of years on assessing that site for the previous owner, so I had a lot of background knowledge and insights. We did our pitch to this developer. It was just the three of us in the room.

Melanie [00:09:25]: At the end of our meeting, the developer turned to my senior colleague, who was probably 10 years older than me, and said point blank, “So how do I know this isn’t a bait and swap? How do I know that you are not selling this as your good work, and then I am going to be stuck with her doing the actual day-to-day?”

Melanie [00:09:47]: I was so shocked because, first, how rude. Second, I was sitting right there, and I am not accustomed to being talked about. In that moment, my colleague did not hesitate.

Melanie [00:10:00]: He very quickly corrected the potential client and said, “No, no, she is the expert you want. She is the technical lead on this. You do not want me to be the technical lead. You want her.”

Melanie [00:10:14]: We did not win that bid, but my senior colleague picked me for the bid, and that is what resonates with me. Examples like that really made me feel like I always worked in a safe environment. I think those kinds of allyship examples also reflect professional integrity.

Melanie [00:10:33]: In preparing for this podcast, I gave some thought to an early experience I had between high school and university. I was sexually harassed every day, and it was exhausting. But that job meant nothing to me. It was just an adventure I was doing on my gap year.

Melanie [00:10:51]: I was not invested in how it would affect my career. Had it been my first professional experience, I would have absolutely left the industry and found something else.

Melanie [00:11:03]: That is where the importance of being surrounded by people who not only recognize your worth but are also willing to step up, communicate your worth, and intervene when needed comes in. I think that is the important thing when it comes to allyship.

Aakanksha [00:11:23]: I feel like that allyship aspect is all the more evident because, in the moment itself, there was no hesitation. It was clear: we picked this person for a reason, they deserve to be here, and that is their role. Even if the outcome was different, I think that is such a win.

Melanie [00:11:42]: I think it all comes back to allyship and representation as well. Knowing that you are in a safe environment, whether it is because you see yourself there or because you know someone has your back if something comes up, makes for an easier work environment.

Aakanksha [00:12:02]: For Victoria, credibility was shaped not only by gender but also by immigration, having an accent, and the assumptions people made before they even had a chance to see her work. Her experiences highlighted how barriers in geosciences are often intersectional.

Aakanksha [00:12:19]: Workers in nontraditional or contract roles can often fall through gaps in protections under laws like the Employment Standards Act. What emerged from the conversation was that having policies in place is not always enough if those systems are not designed with intersectionality in mind. Without that lens, efforts to improve gender equity can still leave many people behind.

Aakanksha [00:12:43]: You mentioned you have extensive international experience. Can you talk to me a little bit about how that has impacted your career? How has it looked different from your experiences in Peru versus in Canada, now that you are here and working in geosciences at the intersection of your identity as an immigrant?

Victoria [00:13:06]: When I moved here to Canada, I brought my credentials. It is hard for us, as immigrants, to show that we are good professionals in our careers. I think there could be more information available about mining so people know the requirements for getting jobs outside of Toronto.

Victoria [00:13:29]: If I had more information, or more technical information focused on mining and geology, that could help a lot. Usually here in Toronto, they give you information about working in construction.

Victoria [00:13:45]: I went through many programs. You cannot believe it, but painting was one. I did solar panel installation and construction too.

Victoria [00:13:55]: For example, I know the mining sector. The mining companies are in Sudbury, Wawa, and Timmins. If people knew that the jobs are not in Toronto, they should tell geologists that.

Victoria [00:14:09]: Instead, they tell you that you can switch your skills to get a job in Toronto or in the GTA. But in the meantime, with the hope that I could get back to my field, it never happened because they were not prepared for this.

Aakanksha [00:14:26]: Fieldwork is a critical part of geosciences. Yet these environments are often remote, isolated, and highly hierarchical — conditions that can make it harder to speak up or access support. Research shows that these risks are not just hypothetical.

Aakanksha [00:14:42]: One study found that 64% of women in field sciences reported experiencing sexual harassment, and more than 20% reported sexual assault during fieldwork. In Ontario, laws like the Occupational Health and Safety Act require employers to have policies and procedures for reporting and investigating workplace harassment.

Aakanksha [00:15:04]: In practice, though, those systems are often internal, and many workers may not feel safe or supported enough to use them. Could you share what those environments have been like for you or for the people you have worked with, especially regarding safety? When we talk about safety, we are referring to both physical and psychological safety.

Victoria [00:15:28]: We were working in our space, and somebody was driving a truck outside. There was a lot of snow outside, and this driver hit the wall with a big truck. We did not know what it was, but we knew we had to call the supervisor or report it immediately so they could come and find out what happened.

Victoria [00:15:50]: We know how to do that because it is about safety. We know how to report. We have our safety cards, and we know the mechanism.

Victoria [00:16:00]: For example, here in the city, there are many places to go if you feel you were treated unfairly or experienced discrimination or harassment. In remote places, the boss or manager is always the one responsible for that.

Victoria [00:16:20]: They always tell the men and women that they have to work with respect. However, it is still a male environment, and sometimes they make jokes. Sometimes they are more sexist.

Victoria [00:16:38]: That is the main difference between being in the city and being in remote places. They talk loudly. There are very “macho” men there, and they make jokes among themselves, but we can’t hear them. As women, we try to ignore it.

Victoria [00:16:56]: For example, I am a lesbian. I did not tell them because I do not have to tell anyone what I am. They assume that when they ask about my son, and I say, “Yes, I have my son,” I also have a husband.

Victoria [00:17:07]: They ask, “What about your husband? Is your husband a geologist too?” I say, “No, he is not,” because they assume that everyone is heterosexual. That is what I did not expect.

Victoria [00:17:18]: I do not mind now, but I think that when I was younger, just being out of the closet could have been hard and harmful for me. I might have felt, “Why do they assume that I am not lesbian? Why do they not ask me?”

Victoria [00:17:35]: Right now, I do not try to show them who I am, but I understand that it is not good to assume who people are. You have to ask. I wondered how to report that. I was thinking of telling the safety supervisor because it is part of our environment to feel safe.

Victoria [00:17:56]: I really did not know how to do it, but the supervisor always tells us, “If you feel something or have something to tell me, just come to me and tell me.” I did not do it because I was working.

Aakanksha [00:18:08]: Do you think you did not feel comfortable enough to talk to her about this aspect of workplace safety and culture, and that is why you did not speak to her?

Victoria [00:18:18]: When we work in these exploration jobs, we have to be on site for 14 days, and then we have 14 days off. During those 14 working days, the same people are not there the entire time. This supervisor was there, I think, for seven days, and then she left to take her days off.

Victoria [00:18:45]: I was thinking of telling her when she came back. But I think it is important to tell the other colleagues that they do not have to assume people are mostly heterosexual. They should not make other people feel bad.

Victoria [00:19:04]: I am a little more worried for young people who are gay or lesbian. It is like re-victimization. You have to say every time, “I am lesbian,” or “I am gay,” and it feels like you have to fight every time to show who you are.

Victoria [00:19:23]: Here in Toronto, in your company or your job, you have HR that is very quick to access. Accessibility is not like that in remote places.

Aakanksha [00:19:33]: But you do see that accessibility when you are working in the city?

Victoria [00:19:37]: Yes, it is different. In the city, it is easier to contact people.

Aakanksha [00:19:42]: That led into a bigger question: what does it take to not just bring women into geosciences, but to help them build long and sustainable careers there? One of the strongest themes tied to retention is caregiving.

Aakanksha [00:19:55]: While Canada’s parental leave policies have expanded over the last 25 years, caregiving responsibilities still disproportionately fall on mothers. According to Statistics Canada, despite recent increases in partners’ uptake of parental benefits and the introduction of benefit top-ups and other incentives aimed at encouraging the sharing of parental leave, women in Canada continue to claim parental benefits at significantly higher rates than their partners.

Aakanksha [00:20:23]: In 2022, for example, 94% of mothers reported claiming or intending to claim parental benefits, compared to 47% of their partners.

Melanie [00:20:36]: I do see that around the time professionals start having families, there are extra challenges in their careers. It sometimes aligns with a time when you are stepping out of the field and into the office, doing more project management work.

Melanie [00:20:53]: Depending on where you are, you could be taking on more leadership on the supervisory side, not just on the project management side, but certainly taking on more responsibility.

Melanie [00:21:04]: Where I am frustrated is that my first pregnancy was during the first year the Canadian government extended EI to a full year for parental leave. The first 15 weeks are maternity leave. That is physical, and it is for the person who actually gave birth. That makes sense.

Melanie [00:21:27]: After that, the 35 weeks were open to either parent. It does not matter if you are an adoptive parent or a same-sex couple. Gender has nothing to do with it at that point.

Melanie [00:21:36]: For our first pregnancy, my husband took the last three months, and it was such a support for me because I could go back to work. I did not have to worry about child care. My kid was at home with daddy, and daddy was out doing all the fun stuff you do with your infant, so I could transition back.

Melanie [00:21:55]: Since that time, I have always been really careful to ask about parental leave. I do not call it maternity leave. If you are gone for a year, it is parental leave. I always ask, “How are you splitting it?”

Melanie [00:22:08]: For the most part, I have been quite disappointed that in the 20-plus years, there are very few cases where the dad has taken significant time or independent time.

Melanie [00:22:20]: As long as we do not have parity, I think that cultural stereotype will invade the professional world in a way that I do not know the industry can really affect.

Aakanksha [00:22:32]: Is that something you have noticed or witnessed yourself: the struggle with parents who have taken that leave when they come back, want to re-enter the field, or have to decide whether they are leaving for good?

Melanie [00:22:46]: I do see a lot of female professionals making career decisions based on what kinds of parental leave packages are available.

Aakanksha [00:22:56]: Do you think having those policies more regulated in other spaces across Canada would be beneficial? Is that the kind of solution that would encourage more people to take it up?

Melanie [00:23:10]: Absolutely. All of the incentives matter. When a couple is deciding how to spend the first year of their child’s life, they consider their finances and the incentives available.

Aakanksha [00:23:23]: By the end of both interviews, one thing became clear: recruitment is only part of the story. What keeps women in geosciences and allows them to advance is shaped by culture, policy, and accountability.

Aakanksha [00:23:37]: It is about whether people are trusted in their roles, whether opportunities are distributed fairly, and whether safety and inclusion are built into everyday practices, especially in environments like fieldwork, where those gaps can be even more visible.

Aakanksha [00:23:53]: Right now, many of the supports that make long-term careers sustainable — like accessible childcare, flexible work, and clear pathways to advancement — are not consistently built into workplace structures. When challenges like caregiving or bias are treated as individual responsibilities, the burden continues to fall disproportionately on women.

Aakanksha [00:24:13]: Melanie and Victoria remind us that women in geosciences do not need to be convinced that they belong. They already know what they bring.

Aakanksha [00:24:23]: Thanks for listening to the first episode of WomanACT’s Podcast Series on Women in STEM. If this conversation resonated with you, be sure to share it and follow along for more episodes exploring women’s experiences across STEM.